[Colchester] The greatest prime minister of all time

[Tom Robbins]

Maggie wasn't the worst we've ever had, but she was one of the most 
significant.

Chris Pritchard wrote:
> but maggie sucked :P
> On 15 Jun 2008, at 15:32, Wayland Sothcott wrote:
>
>> Tom Robbins wrote:
>>> The Internet isn't a power but rather a resource, and unusually for 
>>> a resource is not subject to scarcity. Artificially imposing 
>>> scarcity on it is just a bloody silly idea, which I hope is doomed 
>>> for failure.
>>>
>>> I can be so idealistic some times.
>>>
>>> The New Deal isn't really a good example of Labours activities, 
>>> since it was put into place by John Major's government. I'll agree 
>>> that they have done a lot for vulnerable people, but that has 
>>> included widening the definition of vulnerable to damn near 
>>> everyone. It doesn't make them liberal, it makes them (vaguely) 
>>> benevolent. To paraphrase: a benevolent authoritarian is still 
>>> authoritarian.
>>>
>>> Council housing and unemployment benefits might be nice, but we've 
>>> also had war, paranoia, the undoing of centuries of citizens rights, 
>>> being party to torture and murder, and the surveillance society. Yon 
>>> Tony has been one of the great prime ministers in a similar, 
>>> although slightly less extreme way, to how Hitler was one of the 
>>> great German chancellors: he's achieved some quite spectacular 
>>> things, some of them even benefited the world at large, but a lot of 
>>> it wasn't nice and has been carefully ignored.
>>>
>>> Toby Whaymand wrote:
>>>> I your points are very vialed. With regards to the data protection 
>>>> Act I'm not saying it right or wrong but just that how it is.
>>>> Sadly with great power, (being the internet) comes great 
>>>> responsibility (can't remember which movie or TV show I got that 
>>>> from, prob Star Trek) and there needs to be some kind of control 
>>>> even if it means having new laws that make exceptions to the Data 
>>>> Protection Act.
>>>>
>>>> With regards to Labour without a huge debate they have done a lot 
>>>> for vulnerable people.
>>>> The Council have a legal duty to house anyone who lived in the area 
>>>> for 2 years or have a connection like family members in the area, 
>>>> who have live in the area for over 5 years.
>>>>
>>>> With regards to the unemployment New Deal started within days of 
>>>> Labour coming into power back in 1997 and millions of under 25 
>>>> years old got into employment and higher education.  The type of 
>>>> vulnerable people who otherwise would have been pushed aside.  - To 
>>>> me that very liberal.
>>>>
>>>> I know Labour have made mistakes and I don't want to go into a 
>>>> debate but it is important to remember all the good stuff Mr Blur 
>>>> has done for us.  I would even say he was one of the Great Prime 
>>>> Ministers of are time.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks
>>>>
>>>> Toby
>>>>
>>>> -----------------------------------------
>>>>
>> Tom,
>>
>> I am glad you said all that, for a moment I felt I was living inside 
>> an alternate universe run by the BBC (since David Kelly's death). At 
>> least in terms of government I no longer believe the saying "Never 
>> attribute to malice what can be explained by incompetence". To that I 
>> say "Ooops, so sorry you tripped over my foot, how careless of me to 
>> stretch my leg just as you were hurrying past".
>>
>> Toby,
>>
>> How about tax credits, good thing or bad thing? With the tax system 
>> it's possible and actually required for a person to calculate their 
>> own tax, even if that's an unpleasant job. With tax credits you let a 
>> government agency tell you what you're entitled to, they then pay you 
>> a regular lump of much needed money. If you were not poor then you 
>> would not need tax credits. Then a year later they tell you that you 
>> were overpaid and you have a week to pay back the overpayment. 
>> Government incompetence in such a delicate area looks malicious. It's 
>> inexcusable and it's not a one off.
>>
>> It's time we stopped assuming their heart's in the right place and 
>> that government action that leads to harm was a mistake. There are 
>> too many such 'unfortunate' mistakes for this not to be deliberate. 
>> The fuel tanker drivers are on strike, they are only trying to get a 
>> pay award but I suspect those with holding the pay award are hoping 
>> to gain from the strike itself. Maybe the government can exercise or 
>> extend it's emergency powers? Maybe the price of petrol is driven 
>> further upwards? Remember a very similar thing happened with the 
>> refinery last month. I know that people with 'important' local 
>> authority jobs are getting special documentation to allow them to get 
>> petrol when others cannot. You can't argue with that but is this a 
>> training exercise for when this becomes the norm?
>>
>> I do agree that Tony is one of the Greatest in my lifetime, Maggie 
>> was probably more important.
>>
>> Wayland.
>>
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