From robin592 at yahoo.co.uk  Mon Apr 20 14:47:45 2015
From: robin592 at yahoo.co.uk (Robin Hemuss)
Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2015 14:47:45 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] facebook
Message-ID: <201504201548.58707.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>

Hello people,

I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few months 
old, but still interesting I think.

http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews

It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately 
good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad as a 
result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they 
normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular 
advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.

I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. How can 
you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?

Cheers,
Robin





From les.pritchard at gmail.com  Mon Apr 20 19:53:21 2015
From: les.pritchard at gmail.com (Les Pritchard)
Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2015 19:53:21 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] facebook
In-Reply-To: <201504201548.58707.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>
References: <201504201548.58707.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>
Message-ID: <CAC_G_sDZ5-kLh=BpF_1js_3VUr5pZUXsFfa9rrA2MCV2xXVGQg@mail.gmail.com>

Yes, it was an interesting 'experiment' but the ethical side is really
questionable. I'm sure their view is that it is their network and you agree
to this stuff in the T & C. Facebook certainly does decide what you see,
but you are able to change that if you 'train' your account. In terms of
stopping Facebook from watching you, well on Facebook you're obviously
screwed! To avoid tracking on other sites you'd need to remove all the
cookies so the like buttons couldn't track your visits. You could run you
browser in the private mode and restart it after using Facebook, which
would reduce the tracking ability. Alternatively, use one browser to access
Facebook and then another for every other site. This would mean Facebook
could only see what they already know.

There are plenty of other steps you can take, but those are the simple ones
that spring to mind.

On 20 April 2015 at 15:48, Robin Hemuss <robin592 at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> Hello people,
>
> I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
> months
> old, but still interesting I think.
>
>
> http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
>
> It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately
> good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad as
> a
> result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
> normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
> advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
>
> I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. How
> can
> you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
>
> Cheers,
> Robin
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chester mailing list
> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>
-------------- next part --------------
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From dh at iucr.org  Tue Apr 21 10:26:16 2015
From: dh at iucr.org (David Holden)
Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2015 10:26:16 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] facebook
In-Reply-To: <201504201548.58707.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>
References: <201504201548.58707.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>
Message-ID: <5536259F.10403@iucr.org>

It's a disgraceful exercise IMO. I wonder how many of those experimented 
on were suffering from depression? A "tap tap tap" in the wrong 
direction could lead to devastating consequences if so.

But then it's par for the course with unthinking globocorps like 
FaceBook and Google.

I'm pretty sure I read that Google's identity "merging" around Google+ 
lead to people being outed when they were not ready or wanting to be.

We're witnessing a step change reduction in privacy made all the more 
troubling by the internet's pretty permanent memory and governments need 
to surveil.

Ultimately I suspect we're all going to have to become both a lot more 
forgiving of other peoples private peccadilloes or a lot more shameless 
ourselves.

   Dave.






On 20/04/15 15:48, Robin Hemuss wrote:
> Hello people,
>
> I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few months
> old, but still interesting I think.
>
> http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
>
> It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately
> good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad as a
> result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
> normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
> advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
>
> I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. How can
> you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
>
> Cheers,
> Robin
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chester mailing list
> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>

-- 
Dr David Holden. (dh at iucr.org)



From animation1138 at gmail.com  Tue Apr 21 12:13:13 2015
From: animation1138 at gmail.com (animation animation)
Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2015 12:13:13 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] Chester Digest, Vol 345, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <mailman.9.1429617603.12077.chester@mailman.lug.org.uk>
References: <mailman.9.1429617603.12077.chester@mailman.lug.org.uk>
Message-ID: <CADWs4uxt4806wgs3A7L=jk4sy1AY-ja5Dm6NQnyPQ-kwEH5qdA@mail.gmail.com>

I have seen an article online linking heavy Facebook use to depression.
Facebook envy. People exaggerating how good their lives our makes onlookers
depressed about their own life.
Perhaps mildly bad news on fb will cheer people up.
 On 21 Apr 2015 13:00, <chester-request at mailman.lug.org.uk> wrote:

> Send Chester mailing list submissions to
>         chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>         https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>         chester-request at mailman.lug.org.uk
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>         chester-owner at mailman.lug.org.uk
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Chester digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. facebook (Robin Hemuss)
>    2. Re: facebook (Les Pritchard)
>    3. Re: facebook (David Holden)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2015 15:48:58 +0100
> From: Robin Hemuss <robin592 at yahoo.co.uk>
> To: chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> Subject: [Chester LUG] facebook
> Message-ID: <201504201548.58707.robin592 at yahoo.co.uk>
> Content-Type: text/plain;  charset="us-ascii"
>
> Hello people,
>
> I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
> months
> old, but still interesting I think.
>
>
> http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
>
> It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately
> good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad as
> a
> result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
> normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
> advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
>
> I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. How
> can
> you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
>
> Cheers,
> Robin
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2015 20:53:06 +0100
> From: Les Pritchard <les.pritchard at gmail.com>
> To: chester <chester at mailman.lug.org.uk>
> Subject: Re: [Chester LUG] facebook
> Message-ID:
>         <CAC_G_sDZ5-kLh=
> BpF_1js_3VUr5pZUXsFfa9rrA2MCV2xXVGQg at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Yes, it was an interesting 'experiment' but the ethical side is really
> questionable. I'm sure their view is that it is their network and you agree
> to this stuff in the T & C. Facebook certainly does decide what you see,
> but you are able to change that if you 'train' your account. In terms of
> stopping Facebook from watching you, well on Facebook you're obviously
> screwed! To avoid tracking on other sites you'd need to remove all the
> cookies so the like buttons couldn't track your visits. You could run you
> browser in the private mode and restart it after using Facebook, which
> would reduce the tracking ability. Alternatively, use one browser to access
> Facebook and then another for every other site. This would mean Facebook
> could only see what they already know.
>
> There are plenty of other steps you can take, but those are the simple ones
> that spring to mind.
>
> On 20 April 2015 at 15:48, Robin Hemuss <robin592 at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > Hello people,
> >
> > I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
> > months
> > old, but still interesting I think.
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
> >
> > It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately
> > good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad
> as
> > a
> > result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
> > normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
> > advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
> >
> > I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. How
> > can
> > you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Robin
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chester mailing list
> > Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> > https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
> >
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://mailman.lug.org.uk/pipermail/chester/attachments/20150420/6d669d3b/attachment-0001.html
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2015 11:25:35 +0100
> From: David Holden <dh at iucr.org>
> To: chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> Subject: Re: [Chester LUG] facebook
> Message-ID: <5536259F.10403 at iucr.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
>
> It's a disgraceful exercise IMO. I wonder how many of those experimented
> on were suffering from depression? A "tap tap tap" in the wrong
> direction could lead to devastating consequences if so.
>
> But then it's par for the course with unthinking globocorps like
> FaceBook and Google.
>
> I'm pretty sure I read that Google's identity "merging" around Google+
> lead to people being outed when they were not ready or wanting to be.
>
> We're witnessing a step change reduction in privacy made all the more
> troubling by the internet's pretty permanent memory and governments need
> to surveil.
>
> Ultimately I suspect we're all going to have to become both a lot more
> forgiving of other peoples private peccadilloes or a lot more shameless
> ourselves.
>
>    Dave.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 20/04/15 15:48, Robin Hemuss wrote:
> > Hello people,
> >
> > I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
> months
> > old, but still interesting I think.
> >
> >
> http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
> >
> > It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately
> > good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad
> as a
> > result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
> > normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
> > advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
> >
> > I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. How
> can
> > you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Robin
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chester mailing list
> > Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> > https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
> >
>
> --
> Dr David Holden. (dh at iucr.org)
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chester mailing list
> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>
>
> End of Chester Digest, Vol 345, Issue 1
> ***************************************
>
-------------- next part --------------
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From dh at iucr.org  Tue Apr 21 12:22:50 2015
From: dh at iucr.org (David Holden)
Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2015 12:22:50 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] Chester Digest, Vol 345, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <CADWs4uxt4806wgs3A7L=jk4sy1AY-ja5Dm6NQnyPQ-kwEH5qdA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.9.1429617603.12077.chester@mailman.lug.org.uk>
	<CADWs4uxt4806wgs3A7L=jk4sy1AY-ja5Dm6NQnyPQ-kwEH5qdA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5536410B.3090105@iucr.org>

haha. Fair point. Tips for better mental health - don't do FaceBook or 
Google+ and watch everything PVR so you can skip unreal advertising world.

  Dave.


On 21/04/15 13:12, animation animation wrote:
> I have seen an article online linking heavy Facebook use to depression.
> Facebook envy. People exaggerating how good their lives our makes onlookers
> depressed about their own life.
> Perhaps mildly bad news on fb will cheer people up.
>   On 21 Apr 2015 13:00, <chester-request at mailman.lug.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> Send Chester mailing list submissions to
>>          chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>>
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>          https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>          chester-request at mailman.lug.org.uk
>>
>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>          chester-owner at mailman.lug.org.uk
>>
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of Chester digest..."
>>
>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>>     1. facebook (Robin Hemuss)
>>     2. Re: facebook (Les Pritchard)
>>     3. Re: facebook (David Holden)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2015 15:48:58 +0100
>> From: Robin Hemuss <robin592 at yahoo.co.uk>
>> To: chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>> Subject: [Chester LUG] facebook
>> Message-ID: <201504201548.58707.robin592 at yahoo.co.uk>
>> Content-Type: text/plain;  charset="us-ascii"
>>
>> Hello people,
>>
>> I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
>> months
>> old, but still interesting I think.
>>
>>
>> http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
>>
>> It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately
>> good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad as
>> a
>> result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
>> normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
>> advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
>>
>> I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. How
>> can
>> you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Robin
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2015 20:53:06 +0100
>> From: Les Pritchard <les.pritchard at gmail.com>
>> To: chester <chester at mailman.lug.org.uk>
>> Subject: Re: [Chester LUG] facebook
>> Message-ID:
>>          <CAC_G_sDZ5-kLh=
>> BpF_1js_3VUr5pZUXsFfa9rrA2MCV2xXVGQg at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>
>> Yes, it was an interesting 'experiment' but the ethical side is really
>> questionable. I'm sure their view is that it is their network and you agree
>> to this stuff in the T & C. Facebook certainly does decide what you see,
>> but you are able to change that if you 'train' your account. In terms of
>> stopping Facebook from watching you, well on Facebook you're obviously
>> screwed! To avoid tracking on other sites you'd need to remove all the
>> cookies so the like buttons couldn't track your visits. You could run you
>> browser in the private mode and restart it after using Facebook, which
>> would reduce the tracking ability. Alternatively, use one browser to access
>> Facebook and then another for every other site. This would mean Facebook
>> could only see what they already know.
>>
>> There are plenty of other steps you can take, but those are the simple ones
>> that spring to mind.
>>
>> On 20 April 2015 at 15:48, Robin Hemuss <robin592 at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> Hello people,
>>>
>>> I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
>>> months
>>> old, but still interesting I think.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
>>>
>>> It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately
>>> good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad
>> as
>>> a
>>> result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
>>> normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
>>> advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
>>>
>>> I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. How
>>> can
>>> you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Robin
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chester mailing list
>>> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>>> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>>>
>> -------------- next part --------------
>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>> URL: <
>> http://mailman.lug.org.uk/pipermail/chester/attachments/20150420/6d669d3b/attachment-0001.html
>>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2015 11:25:35 +0100
>> From: David Holden <dh at iucr.org>
>> To: chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>> Subject: Re: [Chester LUG] facebook
>> Message-ID: <5536259F.10403 at iucr.org>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
>>
>> It's a disgraceful exercise IMO. I wonder how many of those experimented
>> on were suffering from depression? A "tap tap tap" in the wrong
>> direction could lead to devastating consequences if so.
>>
>> But then it's par for the course with unthinking globocorps like
>> FaceBook and Google.
>>
>> I'm pretty sure I read that Google's identity "merging" around Google+
>> lead to people being outed when they were not ready or wanting to be.
>>
>> We're witnessing a step change reduction in privacy made all the more
>> troubling by the internet's pretty permanent memory and governments need
>> to surveil.
>>
>> Ultimately I suspect we're all going to have to become both a lot more
>> forgiving of other peoples private peccadilloes or a lot more shameless
>> ourselves.
>>
>>     Dave.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 20/04/15 15:48, Robin Hemuss wrote:
>>> Hello people,
>>>
>>> I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
>> months
>>> old, but still interesting I think.
>>>
>>>
>> http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
>>>
>>> It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately
>>> good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad
>> as a
>>> result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
>>> normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
>>> advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
>>>
>>> I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. How
>> can
>>> you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Robin
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chester mailing list
>>> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>>> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Dr David Holden. (dh at iucr.org)
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chester mailing list
>> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>>
>>
>> End of Chester Digest, Vol 345, Issue 1
>> ***************************************
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chester mailing list
> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>

-- 
Dr David Holden. (dh at iucr.org)



From les.pritchard at gmail.com  Tue Apr 21 12:57:03 2015
From: les.pritchard at gmail.com (Les Pritchard)
Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2015 12:57:03 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] Chester Digest, Vol 345, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <CADWs4uxt4806wgs3A7L=jk4sy1AY-ja5Dm6NQnyPQ-kwEH5qdA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.9.1429617603.12077.chester@mailman.lug.org.uk>
	<CADWs4uxt4806wgs3A7L=jk4sy1AY-ja5Dm6NQnyPQ-kwEH5qdA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAC_G_sAATZnWE0s3t+Aiu2_9mnqGD7WK0JPDnm=gb1vB1tHBfw@mail.gmail.com>

That's a really good point! Maybe they could offer a feed that only shows
their 'friends' looking rough instead of the highly posed selfies!

On 21 April 2015 at 13:12, animation animation <animation1138 at gmail.com>
wrote:

> I have seen an article online linking heavy Facebook use to depression.
> Facebook envy. People exaggerating how good their lives our makes onlookers
> depressed about their own life.
> Perhaps mildly bad news on fb will cheer people up.
>  On 21 Apr 2015 13:00, <chester-request at mailman.lug.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> Send Chester mailing list submissions to
>>         chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>>
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>         https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>         chester-request at mailman.lug.org.uk
>>
>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>         chester-owner at mailman.lug.org.uk
>>
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of Chester digest..."
>>
>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>>    1. facebook (Robin Hemuss)
>>    2. Re: facebook (Les Pritchard)
>>    3. Re: facebook (David Holden)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2015 15:48:58 +0100
>> From: Robin Hemuss <robin592 at yahoo.co.uk>
>> To: chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>> Subject: [Chester LUG] facebook
>> Message-ID: <201504201548.58707.robin592 at yahoo.co.uk>
>> Content-Type: text/plain;  charset="us-ascii"
>>
>> Hello people,
>>
>> I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
>> months
>> old, but still interesting I think.
>>
>>
>> http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
>>
>> It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately
>> good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad
>> as a
>> result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
>> normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
>> advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
>>
>> I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. How
>> can
>> you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Robin
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2015 20:53:06 +0100
>> From: Les Pritchard <les.pritchard at gmail.com>
>> To: chester <chester at mailman.lug.org.uk>
>> Subject: Re: [Chester LUG] facebook
>> Message-ID:
>>         <CAC_G_sDZ5-kLh=
>> BpF_1js_3VUr5pZUXsFfa9rrA2MCV2xXVGQg at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>
>> Yes, it was an interesting 'experiment' but the ethical side is really
>> questionable. I'm sure their view is that it is their network and you
>> agree
>> to this stuff in the T & C. Facebook certainly does decide what you see,
>> but you are able to change that if you 'train' your account. In terms of
>> stopping Facebook from watching you, well on Facebook you're obviously
>> screwed! To avoid tracking on other sites you'd need to remove all the
>> cookies so the like buttons couldn't track your visits. You could run you
>> browser in the private mode and restart it after using Facebook, which
>> would reduce the tracking ability. Alternatively, use one browser to
>> access
>> Facebook and then another for every other site. This would mean Facebook
>> could only see what they already know.
>>
>> There are plenty of other steps you can take, but those are the simple
>> ones
>> that spring to mind.
>>
>> On 20 April 2015 at 15:48, Robin Hemuss <robin592 at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> > Hello people,
>> >
>> > I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
>> > months
>> > old, but still interesting I think.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
>> >
>> > It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately
>> > good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad
>> as
>> > a
>> > result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
>> > normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
>> > advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
>> >
>> > I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. How
>> > can
>> > you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> > Robin
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Chester mailing list
>> > Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>> > https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>> >
>> -------------- next part --------------
>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>> URL: <
>> http://mailman.lug.org.uk/pipermail/chester/attachments/20150420/6d669d3b/attachment-0001.html
>> >
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2015 11:25:35 +0100
>> From: David Holden <dh at iucr.org>
>> To: chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>> Subject: Re: [Chester LUG] facebook
>> Message-ID: <5536259F.10403 at iucr.org>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
>>
>> It's a disgraceful exercise IMO. I wonder how many of those experimented
>> on were suffering from depression? A "tap tap tap" in the wrong
>> direction could lead to devastating consequences if so.
>>
>> But then it's par for the course with unthinking globocorps like
>> FaceBook and Google.
>>
>> I'm pretty sure I read that Google's identity "merging" around Google+
>> lead to people being outed when they were not ready or wanting to be.
>>
>> We're witnessing a step change reduction in privacy made all the more
>> troubling by the internet's pretty permanent memory and governments need
>> to surveil.
>>
>> Ultimately I suspect we're all going to have to become both a lot more
>> forgiving of other peoples private peccadilloes or a lot more shameless
>> ourselves.
>>
>>    Dave.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 20/04/15 15:48, Robin Hemuss wrote:
>> > Hello people,
>> >
>> > I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
>> months
>> > old, but still interesting I think.
>> >
>> >
>> http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
>> >
>> > It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately
>> > good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad
>> as a
>> > result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
>> > normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
>> > advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
>> >
>> > I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is.
>> How can
>> > you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> > Robin
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Chester mailing list
>> > Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>> > https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>> >
>>
>> --
>> Dr David Holden. (dh at iucr.org)
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chester mailing list
>> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>>
>>
>> End of Chester Digest, Vol 345, Issue 1
>> ***************************************
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chester mailing list
> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>
>
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From robin592 at yahoo.co.uk  Tue Apr 21 14:17:50 2015
From: robin592 at yahoo.co.uk (Robin Hemuss)
Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2015 14:17:50 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] Chester Digest, Vol 345, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <CAC_G_sAATZnWE0s3t+Aiu2_9mnqGD7WK0JPDnm=gb1vB1tHBfw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.9.1429617603.12077.chester@mailman.lug.org.uk>
	<CADWs4uxt4806wgs3A7L=jk4sy1AY-ja5Dm6NQnyPQ-kwEH5qdA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC_G_sAATZnWE0s3t+Aiu2_9mnqGD7WK0JPDnm=gb1vB1tHBfw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <201504211519.05501.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>

The thing that got me worried is this book by Anthony Berglas I've been 
skimming through, 'When Computers Can Think'

http://computersthink.com/

Among other stuff he's got a bit in it about ELIZA - the emacs doctor mode?

It's a bit scary because of the view that a super-intelligent computer would 
be smart enough to manipulate us puny-humans into doing all kinds of 
counter-productive things, by feeding us 'designer' info, personalising our 
search results, getting us hooked on cute pictures of kittens - or worse! It 
would manipulate our knowledge and beliefs, shaping our world views and 
identities, and end up getting us hooked. Turning off a super-intelligent 
computer would be like asking a drug dealer to stop selling you drugs.

All a bit far fetched I thought, and then I came across the thing about 
facebook... hmmm...

Robin


On Tuesday 21 April 2015 13:56:45 Les Pritchard wrote:
> That's a really good point! Maybe they could offer a feed that only shows
> their 'friends' looking rough instead of the highly posed selfies!
> 
> On 21 April 2015 at 13:12, animation animation <animation1138 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
> > I have seen an article online linking heavy Facebook use to depression.
> > Facebook envy. People exaggerating how good their lives our makes 
onlookers
> > depressed about their own life.
> > Perhaps mildly bad news on fb will cheer people up.
> >  On 21 Apr 2015 13:00, <chester-request at mailman.lug.org.uk> wrote:
> >
> >> Send Chester mailing list submissions to
> >>         chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> >>
> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> >>         https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> >>         chester-request at mailman.lug.org.uk
> >>
> >> You can reach the person managing the list at
> >>         chester-owner at mailman.lug.org.uk
> >>
> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> >> than "Re: Contents of Chester digest..."
> >>
> >>
> >> Today's Topics:
> >>
> >>    1. facebook (Robin Hemuss)
> >>    2. Re: facebook (Les Pritchard)
> >>    3. Re: facebook (David Holden)
> >>
> >>
> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 1
> >> Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2015 15:48:58 +0100
> >> From: Robin Hemuss <robin592 at yahoo.co.uk>
> >> To: chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> >> Subject: [Chester LUG] facebook
> >> Message-ID: <201504201548.58707.robin592 at yahoo.co.uk>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain;  charset="us-ascii"
> >>
> >> Hello people,
> >>
> >> I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
> >> months
> >> old, but still interesting I think.
> >>
> >>
> >> 
http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
> >>
> >> It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people disproportionately
> >> good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad
> >> as a
> >> result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
> >> normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
> >> advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
> >>
> >> I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. How
> >> can
> >> you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Robin
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 2
> >> Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2015 20:53:06 +0100
> >> From: Les Pritchard <les.pritchard at gmail.com>
> >> To: chester <chester at mailman.lug.org.uk>
> >> Subject: Re: [Chester LUG] facebook
> >> Message-ID:
> >>         <CAC_G_sDZ5-kLh=
> >> BpF_1js_3VUr5pZUXsFfa9rrA2MCV2xXVGQg at mail.gmail.com>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> >>
> >> Yes, it was an interesting 'experiment' but the ethical side is really
> >> questionable. I'm sure their view is that it is their network and you
> >> agree
> >> to this stuff in the T & C. Facebook certainly does decide what you see,
> >> but you are able to change that if you 'train' your account. In terms of
> >> stopping Facebook from watching you, well on Facebook you're obviously
> >> screwed! To avoid tracking on other sites you'd need to remove all the
> >> cookies so the like buttons couldn't track your visits. You could run you
> >> browser in the private mode and restart it after using Facebook, which
> >> would reduce the tracking ability. Alternatively, use one browser to
> >> access
> >> Facebook and then another for every other site. This would mean Facebook
> >> could only see what they already know.
> >>
> >> There are plenty of other steps you can take, but those are the simple
> >> ones
> >> that spring to mind.
> >>
> >> On 20 April 2015 at 15:48, Robin Hemuss <robin592 at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> >>
> >> > Hello people,
> >> >
> >> > I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
> >> > months
> >> > old, but still interesting I think.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> 
http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
> >> >
> >> > It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people 
disproportionately
> >> > good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad
> >> as
> >> > a
> >> > result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
> >> > normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
> >> > advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
> >> >
> >> > I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is. 
How
> >> > can
> >> > you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
> >> >
> >> > Cheers,
> >> > Robin
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > Chester mailing list
> >> > Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> >> > https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
> >> >
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> URL: <
> >> 
http://mailman.lug.org.uk/pipermail/chester/attachments/20150420/6d669d3b/attachment-0001.html
> >> >
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 3
> >> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2015 11:25:35 +0100
> >> From: David Holden <dh at iucr.org>
> >> To: chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> >> Subject: Re: [Chester LUG] facebook
> >> Message-ID: <5536259F.10403 at iucr.org>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
> >>
> >> It's a disgraceful exercise IMO. I wonder how many of those experimented
> >> on were suffering from depression? A "tap tap tap" in the wrong
> >> direction could lead to devastating consequences if so.
> >>
> >> But then it's par for the course with unthinking globocorps like
> >> FaceBook and Google.
> >>
> >> I'm pretty sure I read that Google's identity "merging" around Google+
> >> lead to people being outed when they were not ready or wanting to be.
> >>
> >> We're witnessing a step change reduction in privacy made all the more
> >> troubling by the internet's pretty permanent memory and governments need
> >> to surveil.
> >>
> >> Ultimately I suspect we're all going to have to become both a lot more
> >> forgiving of other peoples private peccadilloes or a lot more shameless
> >> ourselves.
> >>
> >>    Dave.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 20/04/15 15:48, Robin Hemuss wrote:
> >> > Hello people,
> >> >
> >> > I don't know if this is old news for everyone else. The article's a few
> >> months
> >> > old, but still interesting I think.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> 
http://www.nature.com/news/misjudgements-will-drive-social-trials-underground-1.15553?WT.mc_id=TWT_NatureNews
> >> >
> >> > It seems that facebook spent some time feeding people 
disproportionately
> >> > good/bad news in their updates, and monitored if they behaved happy/sad
> >> as a
> >> > result. Apparently this is ethical because it's pretty much what they
> >> > normally do anyway, and also it's not that much different from regular
> >> > advertising. Sounds a bit iffy to me though.
> >> >
> >> > I just wondered what the general opinion over this kind of stuff is.
> >> How can
> >> > you keep your facebook activity secret from facebook?
> >> >
> >> > Cheers,
> >> > Robin
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > Chester mailing list
> >> > Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> >> > https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
> >> >
> >>
> >> --
> >> Dr David Holden. (dh at iucr.org)
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Chester mailing list
> >> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> >> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
> >>
> >>
> >> End of Chester Digest, Vol 345, Issue 1
> >> ***************************************
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Chester mailing list
> > Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> > https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
> >
> >
> 





From robin592 at yahoo.co.uk  Wed Apr 22 00:39:16 2015
From: robin592 at yahoo.co.uk (Robin Hemuss)
Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2015 00:39:16 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] Is it the last thursday or fourth thursday?
Message-ID: <201504220140.34962.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>

To ask a more serious question, is it the last thursday of the month (ie. next 
week) that we meet, or is it the fourth thursday (ie. tomorrow)? And would 
you still like me to do this talk/slides? It's got pictures of chimpanzees in 
it! And only one killer robot, and that isn't even a real one.

Also, it's sketching out a 'use case' for some possible (tamper proof?) 
disscussion software, which may or may not already exist to a greater or 
lesser extent.

Robin





From les.pritchard at gmail.com  Wed Apr 22 07:36:41 2015
From: les.pritchard at gmail.com (Les Pritchard)
Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2015 07:36:41 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] Is it the last thursday or fourth thursday?
In-Reply-To: <201504220140.34962.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>
References: <201504220140.34962.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>
Message-ID: <CAC_G_sC6YpWnoZvmEHYv296O4wa5EyWhZywQ8i4BEiGA2TrHNA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Robin,

It's the last Thursday of the month, so next week. Happy for you to bring
along the talk - surely no set of slides is really complete without a photo
of a primate :-)

Les
On 22 Apr 2015 01:39, "Robin Hemuss" <robin592 at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> To ask a more serious question, is it the last thursday of the month (ie.
> next
> week) that we meet, or is it the fourth thursday (ie. tomorrow)? And would
> you still like me to do this talk/slides? It's got pictures of chimpanzees
> in
> it! And only one killer robot, and that isn't even a real one.
>
> Also, it's sketching out a 'use case' for some possible (tamper proof?)
> disscussion software, which may or may not already exist to a greater or
> lesser extent.
>
> Robin
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chester mailing list
> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>
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From robin592 at yahoo.co.uk  Thu Apr 30 11:02:13 2015
From: robin592 at yahoo.co.uk (Robin Hemuss)
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2015 11:02:13 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] Thursday Linux Meet
Message-ID: <201504301203.50218.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>

Hello all,

Is it still on for this evening at the Funky Aardvark?

What time do we get there?

Cheers,

Robin




From joe.foy at gmail.com  Thu Apr 30 14:40:58 2015
From: joe.foy at gmail.com (Joe Foy)
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2015 14:40:58 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] Thursday Linux Meet
In-Reply-To: <201504301203.50218.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>
References: <201504301203.50218.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>
Message-ID: <CAMxP1BAPOqxTppJE7T6KxFqzW1dy6bytHYvt1rOkMLMuOAL+kA@mail.gmail.com>

As far as I am aware it is still on for this evening at funky aardvark, I
will be getting there between 7:30 and 8:00 so any time after then is a
good time to arrive.

On 30 April 2015 at 12:03, Robin Hemuss <robin592 at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> Hello all,
>
> Is it still on for this evening at the Funky Aardvark?
>
> What time do we get there?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Robin
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chester mailing list
> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>
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From les.pritchard at gmail.com  Thu Apr 30 16:55:58 2015
From: les.pritchard at gmail.com (Les Pritchard)
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2015 16:55:58 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] LUG Meet
Message-ID: <CAC_G_sA517A30=C5yyYA7dQ5S890CYq3y-vZ3UBNNYN8jE0qbg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

I'm very sorry, Tom has just reminded me of the date and the LUG is
supposed to be tonight! I know we spoke about it a week or so ago, but this
week I've been laid up with a nasty bug so completely lost track of the
dates.

I haven't checked with the Funky Aardvark so I'm not sure if they'll be
open tonight. If they're not, I'm sure a move to the local pub would be
suitable!

I'm still not right, so I'm afraid I won't be able to make it tonight. Hope
you have a good evening.

Les
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From les.pritchard at gmail.com  Thu Apr 30 16:56:48 2015
From: les.pritchard at gmail.com (Les Pritchard)
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2015 16:56:48 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] Thursday Linux Meet
In-Reply-To: <CAMxP1BAPOqxTppJE7T6KxFqzW1dy6bytHYvt1rOkMLMuOAL+kA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <201504301203.50218.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>
	<CAMxP1BAPOqxTppJE7T6KxFqzW1dy6bytHYvt1rOkMLMuOAL+kA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAC_G_sCYG=PEiW13z4EVYHHEdGCY0ggW8WuoLZ1voYgFip6d7A@mail.gmail.com>

Sorry, just catching up on emails and missed this. Hope you have a good
evening!

On 30 April 2015 at 15:40, Joe Foy <joe.foy at gmail.com> wrote:

> As far as I am aware it is still on for this evening at funky aardvark, I
> will be getting there between 7:30 and 8:00 so any time after then is a
> good time to arrive.
>
> On 30 April 2015 at 12:03, Robin Hemuss <robin592 at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> Hello all,
>>
>> Is it still on for this evening at the Funky Aardvark?
>>
>> What time do we get there?
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Robin
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chester mailing list
>> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
>> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Chester mailing list
> Chester at mailman.lug.org.uk
> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/chester
>
>
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From robin592 at yahoo.co.uk  Thu Apr 30 17:05:20 2015
From: robin592 at yahoo.co.uk (Robin Hemuss)
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2015 17:05:20 -0000
Subject: [Chester LUG] LUG Meet
In-Reply-To: <CAC_G_sA517A30=C5yyYA7dQ5S890CYq3y-vZ3UBNNYN8jE0qbg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC_G_sA517A30=C5yyYA7dQ5S890CYq3y-vZ3UBNNYN8jE0qbg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <201504301806.49841.robin592@yahoo.co.uk>

Get well soon Les!

I called in at the FA earlier on, and they say it's all still on and 
everything. 7:30 onwards.

Robin


On Thursday 30 April 2015 17:55:51 Les Pritchard wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> I'm very sorry, Tom has just reminded me of the date and the LUG is
> supposed to be tonight! I know we spoke about it a week or so ago, but this
> week I've been laid up with a nasty bug so completely lost track of the
> dates.
> 
> I haven't checked with the Funky Aardvark so I'm not sure if they'll be
> open tonight. If they're not, I'm sure a move to the local pub would be
> suitable!
> 
> I'm still not right, so I'm afraid I won't be able to make it tonight. Hope
> you have a good evening.
> 
> Les
>