[dundee] Your views on why linux is better than MS other others OS's

Tue Dec 11 23:51:39 GMT 2007

Hello everyone...  I've been lurking on the list for a few days now
after taking a look at the archives and seeing the community had grown
substantially since I'd last checked (a year ago).... Anyway, I'll
maybe pop along sometime in the new year to say hello, but I found
this thread interesting, and thought I'd chip in.

I've been a Linux user and evangelist for a long time now, and am
continually amazed at the innovation and disruption Linux and FLOSS
are causing.

About a month ago I stumbled across the Eeepc and finally saw a device
which I've felt has been technically possible around it's price point
for a year or so now.  As David says the one size fits all approach
taken by Microsoft is a missed opportunity, and an area where they'll
struggle to compete with Linux and the FLOSS stack.   Anyway, after
seeing the Eeepc (and getting my boss to buy me one :-) ) I realised
that it and other UMPC devices represent a huge (if inevitable) step
forward for Linux.

Anyway, I wrote a blog post about how I think it's not Desktop Linux
that's important it's Laptop Linux that matters:

http://sourcesmouth.co.uk/blog/Forget-the-Linux-Desktop-it-s-the-Linux-Laptop-that-matters.html

Anyway, good luck with your OLPC purchases... I'll let you know now,
that I hope to have a  look at them when I pop in next year.

All the best.

R.

On 11/12/2007, Lee Turner <lvturner at gmail.com> wrote:
> I haven't read all your e-mail, but I'm going to have to disagree with you
> on point number five
>
> <quote>
> 5)Development system
>
> Linux is a development system, and comes with tools
> built in to develop itself. MS needs extra lib's and
> programs before you start writing code. Most which
> cost $$$$
> </qoute>
>
> You can program in windows with many many free languages, and if you want
> .NET all you need is CSC.exe (part of the free .NET SDK) and notepad... or
> any other freeware editor.
>
> Heck, you could even use mono and monodevelop :)
>
> Admittedly, Visual Studio is /very/ expensive (then again they do give away
> free editions...) but it is also /very/ nice.
>
> Windows has it's place in this world weather we like it or not. However, I
> completely disagree with it being pre-installed on systems that are store
> bought!! So massive props to Asus and their linux-pre-loaded EEE PC (I've
> got one, it's lovely - I feel sorry for the idiots trying to cram XP onto
> it)
>
> The only way to work out the 'best' operating system is to do a proper
> feasibility study, weigh up your requirements against what the operating
> system does - even then, you won't get an answer as a lot of it comes down
> to applications that the operating system can use - or additional hardware
> that it can support.
>
> A prime example of this - my quadcore desktop machine with spiffy graphics
> card runs windows XP - because by far it gives the easiest and fastest route
> into playing the games I enjoy - it's predominantly a gaming system.
>
> My Asus EEE PC runs Asus's Xandrox based Linux, because I want it to have
> quick startup times, be tailored to the hardware exactly and only require it
> for e-mail/word proc/web browsing etc.
>
> My webserver runs Debian - because it's tried tested and bloody stable (600+
> days uptime inclusive of an entire operating system upgrade done at about
> 300 days)
>
> At work, I use Vista... because I have to.
>
> Taters
>
>
> On 11/12/2007, Lee Hughes <toxicnaan at yahoo.co.uk > wrote:
> > hmmm.. It's a computers, and it's software, so it's
> > rubbish.
> >
> > It's just certain degrees of rubbish that you have
> > to contend with. Linux I find slightly less rubbish
> > than windows!
> >
> > Seriously.
> >
> > 1)
> > Linux is source code based. So you can always
> > fix the problem or get a programmer to fix it for you.
> >
> > MS, is a closed shop, even if you know the answer
> > you can't repair your system with a patch, your
> > not allowed. THERE IS ALWAYS A FIX with LINUX!
> >
> >
> > 2)Linux is about freedom of choice, allowing you
> > to replace key systems components with alternatives,
> > don't like cron, use vixie-cron, dont' like gnome,
> > use kde..etc etc.
> >
> > MS , you get it, and that's it, they way the system
> > is designed makes replacing key systems components
> > impossible. MS don't live on on One Microsoft way
> > for no reason!
> >
> >
> > 3) Stability, I find Linux a lot more stable than
> > windows. For servers , why do you need a GUI
> > component?
> > Even windows administrators can't answer that one.
> >
> >
> > 4)Security
> >
> > Security patches seem to be release more quickly on
> > linux platforms. Microsoft have a strange mindset
> > when it comes to security engineering.
> >
> > Due to the way leagacy microsoft security has worked,
> > it's too late to implement good securiy on the MS
> > platform. How many users run as adminstrator because
> > they have no notion of the basic, normal user,
> > and administrative user. They system is shocking.
> >
> > Microsoft like features.., features they think
> > make them money! However every feature increase
> > the security problems. How many features do you
> > use in MS OFFICE 10%? 20% 50%. Software has to
> > be simpler to remain secure.
> >
> >
> > 5)Development system
> >
> > Linux is a development system, and comes with tools
> > built in to develop itself. MS needs extra lib's and
> > programs before you start writing code. Most which
> > cost $$$$
> >
> >
> > 6)Has what you need, does'nt have some of of what
> > you don't. It's not Bloatware!!
> >
> >
> > 7)Millions of potential developers working on it.
> >
> > I'm always shocked that MS core products are written
> > by small teams , locked away in the HQ. Linux has
> > developers from all over the world. Have you ever
> > thought that some, apart from an American could have
> > the next best idea in regards to software development?
> >
> > There's a whole planet out there, waiting submit
> > patches and write programs.
> >
> >
> > 8) Culture is about Solving Problems , not making
> > money.
> >
> > Linux has a strong history of solving computing
> > engineering problems. Microsoft do have some very
> > cool solutions to component software, now with
> > it's .net model. But Any attempt by microsoft go
> > 'cross platform' is looked upon by suspicion.
> > Embrace , Extended and Extinguish !!!
> >
> > 9)
> > Open standards, If I build one piece of software,
> > I know, with little effort I can interface it to
> > another piece of linux software quite easily.
> >
> > If my configuration files are stored as .txt or
> > xml, I know other programs can probably read this
> > format.
> >
> > Microsoft have bizzare databases to keep configuration
> > data within the operating system. This system is
> > complex and not well understood.
> >
> >
> > 10)
> > If I take a hard drive of a linux system from one
> > computer, and place it within another, it works!
> > different hardware configuration...it's just another
> > computer to the linux kernel.
> >
> > Microsoft, one the O/S is install, it is in stone,
> > moving it to another system will me a total reintall,
> > or require the use of expensive tools.
> >
> > 11)
> >
> > Reinstalls, how many microsoft systems need to be
> > reinstalled due to software failure?
> >
> > How many man hours on this planet has microsoft
> > cost us in reinstalling systems. I'd hate
> > to calculate
> >
> >
> > 12) Software quality.
> >
> > Software quality seems, higher, linux hackers take
> > pride in their software release. Microsoft is
> > if it compiles, get it on the door! The platform
> > attacks hard to understand and resource hog
> > software. I'd say MS programmers don't know much
> > about software optomisation? WHy would they need
> > to, just upgrade the hardware, and at the same
> > time make MS a bit more money!!
> >
> > 13) Testing and Feedback
> >
> > If I submit bug reports for linux system, I usually
> > get some kind of response, even if it's not the
> > response I want!! at least it something.
> >
> > I have on more that one occasion been able to
> > speak to the developer *ACTUALLY* wrote the code.
> > and was able to resolve a fix!
> >
> >
> > Microsoft, how many people have actually talked
> > to anyone at microsoft! Apart from trying to
> > get a new license key, or activiation !!!
> >
> > 14)
> >
> > Clusters.
> >
> > You can't use MS products for clusters due to thier
> > per cpu charges!! Linux you can install a 1000 for
> > free!
> > Clusters make sense for linux!
> >
> > 15)
> >
> > one size fits all. How can one operating system
> > be ge good at all tasks. Computer researchers needs
> > to compile thier own kernel! Graphics guys need
> > optomised gpu systems, etc etc.
> >
> > this microsoft , NT does it all! How wrong can you
> > be...
> >
> > systems need to be tailored to the task, not the
> > other way around.
> >
> > 16) Distros...
> >
> > you've got a choice to run run red hat over suse?
> > debian over ubunutu, do it!!!
> >
> > settle on something you like!"
> >
> > the core of the systems are the same, it's linux,
> > and it's open.
> >
> >
> > 17) Learning. There's a lot of material out there to
> > learn unix and linux. I mean it's high quality and
> > in depth. Linux poeple usually know alot more about
> > thier machines , and whats going on behind the scenes.
> >
> > Microsoft poeple, tend to click , click , click,
> > it's so easy, but they can't tell you exactly what
> > those clicks are doing in terms of how the machine
> > is operating...dangerous mindset!
> >
> > 18) MS have not much going on in the idea department!
> > If I sit here, and say to myself, hey I've got a great
> > Idea of a tool that I need, then I can write it. Then
> > I could probably send it someone, and they go, I like
> > this, I'll bundle it with my distro.
> >
> > bang! it's part of the operating system.
> >
> >
> > 18) It's cheap.
> >
> > OLPC can keep thier costs down, whilst providing top
> > notch tools. If they shipped XP, then hey, that's
> > twice the base price already, and the laptop would
> > need to be twice as powerful to run notepad!!!
> >
> > So they really have shot themself in the foot
> > with this one.
> >
> > Do you know the the original Internet Explorer
> > was written by no less than Three guys at MS?
> >
> > now think about the economics,
> > three guys can develop a piece of software the
> > whole world uses? now do the math?
> >
> > you don't even need to put it on CD rom, it
> > has no physical form apart from 0/1 within
> > your computers, or down the internet!
> >
> > interesting. so how can software have such
> > a large price tag? How can microsoft justify
> > it's price tag for XP?
> >
> > it certainly not research and development is it!
> >
> >
> > I'm not talking full blown apps here, I'm talking
> > utilites that make your life easier.
> >
> > Microsoft does'nt come with any of these tools,
> > they want you to buy norton utils or something?
> >
> > Microsoft you get a kernel! and notepad!
> > that's it!
> >
> > Hopefully with linux you get thousands of tools
> > you can start being productive straight away.
> >
> > ---------------
> >
> > Distros seems to differ on in terms of
> >
> > Window Manager (KDe , Gnome , something)
> > Package management
> > Upgrade Cycles
> > Package availability.
> > Lib's and Kernel Levels.
> >
> > task .. I.e server, workstation, development, games!
> >
> >
> > if you don't beleive any of this propergander..
> >
> >
> > install vista...
> >
> > do you see that running on a $100 dollar laptop.
> >
> > I rest my case.
> >
> > Where do I see microsoft in years time?
> >
> > Micro who?
> >
> >
> > They've already lost the battle.
> >
> > We all know we're going to be using openBSD in 2017
> > ;-) hahahaha.
> >
> > Developers, Developers , Developers.
> >
> > Oh, Bill was jsut announced 1st richest man in
> > America today..
> >
> > Well done Bill!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- David Thornton Snr <davidthorntonsnr at yahoo.co.uk>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Hi all,
> > > I'm looking for views on the above subject and to be
> > > truthful any other input to include on my website.
> > > Is it the ease of use? package updates? built-in
> > > utilities, etc.
> > > Also any 'how tos' that you have found useful.
> > > Or why you think that XXX distro is better than YYY.
> > > In other words any info that you think would be good
> > > to include on the site
> > > I (with agreement) will put a link to Tlug and any
> > > other link you think would be good to include if you
> > > let me know.
> > >
> > > I'm not looking for anything else but if you think
> > > of anything else please email me.
> > >
> > > It's not an all singing and dancing site, I've tried
> > > to keep it simple to make it fast loading.
> > > The site and content is coming along nicely.
> > >
> > > cheers everyone
> > > Have a nice Christmas and a Happy New Year.
> > >
> > > Dave
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> __________________________________________________________
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> > > http://uk.mail.yahoo.com
> > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > Chat on IRC, #tlug on dundee.lug.org.uk
> >
> >
> >
> >
> __________________________________________________________
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> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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>
>
>
> --
> <generic witty comment>
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-- 
Rick
rick.moynihan at gmail.com
http://sourcesmouth.co.uk/blog/