[Gllug] Website developement

[David Freeman]

 --- Alex Hudson <hudson_a at alexhudson.com> wrote: > On 15 Jul 2001, Nix
wrote:
> > > Perl is higher level than both C and Java, probably also Lisp
> > 
> > That you say this indicates either that you do not know anything
> about
> > Lisp, or, perhaps, that you don't know what the phrase `higher
> level'
> > means :(
> 
> Obviously. Go on, tell me why the oldest high-level language in
> existence,
> the one based on IBM machine code, is higher level than Perl...

I'm sorry, no matter what people say Perl is a write only language.

> > Don't count your chickens before they're hatched. I'm sure Skud and
> the
> > rest of the language design people will try hard to ensure that it
> will
> > rock, but you can't *know* that until after it's released.
> 
> Sure I do :-) I know the sun's coming up tomorrow morning - that
> hasn't
> happened yet though. The probability of it not happening is so small
> it's
> effectively 0.

You can't say that you do not no the sun will come up, but it pleases
you to beleive that it will. After all what is the sun? whats the
meaning of up? whats the meaning of tomorrow? try defineing each of
these and then define each term you use in the definition and
eventually you get self references. which means you now need to get a
lower or higher level language to describe it and reduce/increase the
abstraction, untill you get to the point where you can neither prove
nor disprove that the sun will or wont come up tomorrow and decide that
the best thing to do is drink.

We can't say the sun will come up cos we can't say we know the sun
exist, likewise we can't say we exist.

There is no spoon.
 
> > > first is separate presentation from content, which is where
> templates (et
> > 
> > This is, of course, the only sane way.
> 
> Sane for who? It's _easy_, perhaps, but leads to crap web pages :P

No he's right, if content and presentation are seperate you can change
the presentation easily, or you can get the middle ground with XML and
use that to change the meaning of the markup.
 
> > > but gives the best results.
> > 
> > ... that is, it can look nice on totally broken browsers like
> Netscape 4
> > and IE3, but can't change its appearance to compensate for
> variations in
> > browser capability, is very hard to do, and is generally a Bad
> Idea.
> 
> No, not quite. Separating your presentation from your content doesn't
> magically lead to good HTML, and vice versa.

no but you get consistant HTML ocross the site.
 
> > Everything I produce is designed properly. I can't see the point in
> > going through endless agony to compensate for browsers with no
> style
> > sheet support; they get a really plain look and have to live with
> it.
> 
> That wasn't the point I was making :) Complete separation of content
> from
> presentation leads to dull, repetitive websites, and I would argue is
> also
> bad design. Information is the context lent to data (at least
> partially),
> and people use presentation to draw attention to different bits of
> data to
> be informative. I'm not saying that's impossible with templates, but
> it's
> a lot harder - either you need to have a lot of very similar
> information
> (like a directory, shop, etc.) or you need a lot of specialised
> templates. For a smaller site, I'd argue it's better to dump complete
> content/presentation separation, and have a mix. 

If you look at the site in question you will see the data is all very
similiar.

Thanks

D
 
> Cheers,
> 
> Alex.
> 
> 
> -- 
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