[Gllug] amongst the maddness

[sean at uncertainty.org.uk]

On Sat, Sep 15, 2001 at 11:05:46AM +0100, Bruce Richardson wrote:
> On Sat, Sep 15, 2001 at 12:20:30AM +0100, gllug at uncertainty.org.uk wrote:
> > the word libertarian seems to mean something different in the US of A
> 
> I think the distinction to be careful with is between liberal and
> libertarian.  Libertarians focus on the rights of the individual,
> liberals balance this against the needs of the social group.  There is
> some common ground - attitudes to drug legalisation - some areas of
> total opposition (e.g. gun control) and some areas of ambivalence
> (libertarians tend to hate government, liberals tend to be wary of its
> abuses while believing in its value to society).
> 
> The social mix on technical mailing lists/ngs with a strong American
> membership is different - many libertarians, fewer liberals (the word
> still seems to mean 'communist' to many Americans), no socialists
> (unless there are any Europeans on the list;)).



http://dictionary.cambridge.org/define.asp?key=libertarian*1+0

libertarian   noun, adjective [C] 
(a person) believing that people should be free to think and behave as
they want and should not have limits put on them by governments 
Civil libertarians are worried about what they see as government
censorship.


it seems to me that pretty much everyone agrees that some limits should
apply (flying airoplanes into buildings is a civil liberty to far)

in  the UK most people who might describe themselves as libertarians
would probably say that carrying guns reduces the liberty of those who
get shot more than it increases the liberty of those who carry guns

also most libertarians here believe that corporations are more like
governments than individuals - and restricting corporations freedoms (eg
banning tobaco advertising) increases individual freedom (to breath).

in the us carrying guns is seen as a fundamental right - and while in a
way I can see the argument that an armed populatiom would be harder to
suppress by a tyranical state, I would say that the right to protest, to
gather freely and to communicate unmonitored are far more important
protective rights that are also more threatened (more so since tuesday)

as far as RMS is concerned I see him as a bit of a mad genius - I think
he has started something incredible but I feel he no longer helps
further the aims of open source that I care most about - he is far to
fundamentalist for my taste and certainly seems to scare of a lot of
techies who are curios about open source.

-- 

Sean

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