[Phpwm] Job Opportunities

Mike Tipping mike at etuna.co.uk
Tue Mar 22 09:57:04 UTC 2011 

Interesting and possibly relevant discussion:

http://forum.boagworld.com/discussion/6279/what-makes-a-good-php-programmer
/#Item_11

On salary I think the key thing with Junior developers is that you are
often taking people who are looking for jobs (school leavers or career
change) so can probably gat away with paying anything as long as the job
is good and convenient. Start them low and offer rapid progression.

Good senior developers have generally already got a job that has been
going through pay increments so is paid higher than the basic. To get them
you need to offer a better job or a better salary. You probably don't the
Senior developers who are looking for a job.

Regardless of whether IT is in recession or not I think you would have to
be brave at the moment to leave a job you've been in for more than 2 years
to go somewhere new unless the offer was very good or you had a change of
circumstance that required it.

If you want to recruit good senior developers:

- Get involved in the community and build a name for yourself and your
organisation
- Pick the people in the community you know can work at the level you want
and you like.
- Approach them directly and headhunt.

If you're looking for work:

- Get involved in the community and build a name for yourself .
- Pick the people in the community you want to work for and like.
- Approach them directly.



On 22/03/2011 09:25, "keith Pope" <mute.pop3 at googlemail.com> wrote:

>On 21 March 2011 10:56, Alex Mace <alex at hollytree.co.uk> wrote:
>> Sad to say all of our recent hires have come through agents. Even I
>>joined though an agent, although I had previously sent my CV through
>>with a letter and got no response.
>>
>> We had quite a good experience with Williams Resource - they had a list
>>of set questions to ask candidates that was quite good at sorting the
>>wheat from the chaff. Jon Glas at CV Bay sent us through some good stuff
>>as well.
>
>I have had dealings with Jon Glas before and he was very helpful, that
>was from a candidate side though :)
>
>It is a shame that in the UK all recruitment seems to be agency based,
>compare this to the US where it seems to be mostly direct like at
>dice.com. The amount of times you see an advert on cwjobs and go I
>wonder who that is and spend a few hours trying to find which company
>it is for!
>
>If you are using a agency try and make them include some text that
>will be searchable in google back to your site, I have been able to
>find the actual company a few times that way and we all prefer to go
>direct!
>
>With salaries I would say (for my industry aviation):
>
>Senior Developer - 35,000 to 45,000+ pa
>Junior Developer - 20,000 to 30,000 pa
>
>For me a senior role is a lot more than programming, they need to
>lease with the business, help the team distil information, mentor the
>junior developers, keep track of architecture, motivate the team etc.
>Its not an easy job and carries a lot of responsibility to the
>business.
>
>With juniors the skill level can vary a lot, so it really a question
>of judgement.
>
>>
>> I've tried posting stuff to here, twitter and other places to no
>>response.
>>
>> Alex
>>
>> On 21 Mar 2011, at 10:27, Nick Downton wrote:
>>
>>> Where do you guys find works the best for advertising positions?
>>> We have tried quite a lot of job boards but never really got what I
>>> would call a good response. In fact, the job centre always seem to get
>>> the most candidates through the door!
>>> Also, we are thinking our ad copy may not be quite right. At the
>>> moment it is very formal, straight from HR department. We were
>>> thinking of going a bit less formal.
>>>
>>> Currently looking for another two developers, fairly junior for 20 -
>>>25.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Nick
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Mar 20, 2011 at 10:08 AM, Alex Mace <alex at hollytree.co.uk>
>>>wrote:
>>>> We ended up hiring a couple Graduates as "Junior" Developers at 20k+.
>>>> We interviewed quite a lot whose salary demands were in your "Senior"
>>>> range, but then found their skillsets weren't able to justify the
>>>> demands. Some of that may just be down to the fact that we (at
>>>> Namesco) have different demands because we work with the same large
>>>> codebase to support a business, so we require a more in depth
>>>> knowledge than an agency would.
>>>>
>>>> Just FYI though, I started as a Junior engineer at £16k 8 years ago,
>>>> so I would have expected that to have moved on towards £20k by now.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>>
>>>> Alex
>>>>
>>>> On 20 Mar 2011, at 09:13, Tim Cumming <tim at cybacat.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> What did you end up doing Alex?
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: phpwm-bounces at mailman.lug.org.uk
>>>>> [mailto:phpwm-bounces at mailman.lug.org.uk] On Behalf Of Alex Mace
>>>>> Sent: 19 March 2011 10:52 PM
>>>>> To: West Midlands PHP User Group
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Phpwm] Job Opportunities
>>>>>
>>>>> Good luck with those rates, based on my experience recruiting a few
>>>>> people last year, you're going to need it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>
>>>>> Alex
>>>>>
>>>>> On 19 Mar 2011, at 22:38, Rob Allen <rob at akrabat.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Tim,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We're currently sorting out the spec for a new Senior Developer and
>>>>>> I'm hugely relieved to see that the budget we have is about the same
>>>>>> as you :)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Rob...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 17 Mar 2011, at 12:18, Tim Cumming wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Everyone,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Due to re-structuring we have THREE positions available that are
>>>>>>> being advertised in local media at the moment.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> These are:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Senior Developer (supervisory role) - 22,500 to 30,000 pa Junior
>>>>>>> Developer - 15,500 to 18,000 pa Designer/Junior Developer - 15,500
>>>>>>>to
>>>>>
>>>>>>> 18,000 pa
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For more information, job descriptions and details of how to apply
>>>>>>> please go to http://www.cybacat.com/careers/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> NO AGENCIES PLEASE!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tim
>>>>>>> Cybacat Ltd - 0845 833 4447
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>
>
>
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>------------
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