[Sussex] LINUX on Mini-ITX / Via?

Fri Jan 10 09:51:00 UTC 2003

Hi

I have been looking at the thin client model for a while, and the price
is slightly cheap for x86 thin clients the x86 pc's but not by much, as
if you go for the small look (which I would as the look so much better)
u pay a bit more for everything to be shrunk.

However, that said I would go for the client server model where I can,
as it allows for easier administration and control, especially when
updating packages and security.

Also look at going wireless with it. I have tried it and it works well.
If all people are doing low intensity stuff like open office bits then
they dont need the faster networks.

Mark

On Fri, 2003-01-10 at 09:29, Steve Dobson wrote:
> Hi
> 
> On 10 January 2003 at 08:50 Geoff Teale wrote:
> > Neil "smudgey pixels" Ford wrote:
> > > I have to say I like the look of the Linitx box with 3 NICs and IPCop 
> > > on Compact Flash as a nice neat firewall solution. No moving parts 
> > > except the fans.
> > 
> > Yup.. fom parts its perfectly possible to build these things without the
> > fans.  I like the idea of diskless nodes booting from Compact Flash.
> Netbox
> > advocate this for office desktops - they recommend using LINUX the old
> > fashioned way (One _fat_ sever and a bunch of cheap, diskless nodes
> running
> > XServer as clients) - they try and sell this idea on their website
> > http://www.netbox.co.uk/netbox/html/networking.htm .  I think it's
> something
> > people should push more - why go for an expensive full PC on every desk
> > option when you can play to UNIX/LINUX's strengths instead?
> 
> I use to agree with you, but having working here for a while with a Web
> server
> based GUI I don't any more.  My major complaint is performance, or the lack
> there
> of.  If to many clients are connected the server can run slow, either
> because
> the CPUs are overloaded, or because of a bottleneck of a particular resource
> (disk,
> network, ...).  The other problem is a single point of failure (or even more
> expensive hard-/soft-ware for fail-over).
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I do like the client/server model, but it needs to be
> applied
> with full knowledge of it's use; and the server needs enough resources to
> provide
> a reasonable response to the user.  I think this model works well for
> applications
> but not for personal computing resource.
> 
> > They certainly would make a stylish alternative to something like Suns
> > SunRay1, 100 & 150 thin clients - the only problem being that Netboxen are
> > rather pricey (though they are stylish and well built).  That said the
> price
> > of the sun thin client boxes seems to have risen recently (Steve?).
> 
> I can't say that I am currently tracking the prices of Sun kit (or any other
> hardware for that matter).  But price is another issue here.  What's the
> delta
> between the thin client and a full x86 PC these days?  Give the volume of
> x86
> systems and the discounts companies buying large number get I would suggest
> that the x86 system is cheaper.
> 
> The problem that need to be solved here is the administration one.  It is
> far,
> far easier (and cheaper) to admin on central server, and this cost saving 
> may (I only say may) make the thin client a cheaper solution.  But if we
> could
> find a way to centrally admin a number of remote systems then we could have
> the
> best of both worlds:
> 
>   1). an easy to admin central pool of system, and
> 
>   2). the power of a full system on my desk dedicated to doing my work.
> 
> As you mentioned Sun, I remember they came up with a system a few years back
> 
> called cashefs.  A central file server hosted the "disks" of the remote
> clients.
> Each client had a disk, but it was just a cache for the centralised data
> store.
> The performance figures I saw showed almost the same performance as a
> stand-alone
> system, and was significantly faster than "standard" diskless nodes.
> 
> What also impressed me about that set-up is that an older and slower system
> (SPARC 5) could support up to 10-15 faster systems (SPARC 20s).
> 
> I have of course ignored in this my biggest bug bare in these centralised 
> set-ups.  As a developers I sometimes need more control over my box than the
> standard plebe user.  But then I know that I (we developers and SysAdmins on
> this list) are different and have special needs ;-)
> 
> Steve
> 
> _______________________________________________
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> Sussex at mailman.lug.org.uk
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-- 

Mark Olliver
mark at olliver.me.uk
+44 7881 910782

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-- 

Mark Olliver

Thermeon Europe Ltd
Russ Hill Farm
Russ Hill
Charlwood
Surrey
UK
+44 1293 864300

mpo at thermeoneurope.com
www.thermeoneurope.com

UK Support 0906 515908
INT Support +44 1293 864341
Fax +44 20 7681 3907

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