if a directory has permissions: drwxr-x--- 16 bascule mame 4096 Sep 7 2001 mame/ why might a user who is a member of group mame not be able to access the mame directory, mame is in /data which has perms: drwxr-xr-x 6 bascule bascule 4096 Oct 16 00:23 data/ bascule -- The truth may be out there, but lies are inside your head. (Hogfather)