[Wolves] Red Hat Enterprise Server

[sparkes]

Andy Wootton wrote:
> sparkes wrote:
> 
>> Andy Wootton wrote:
>>
>>> It isn't fair to compare the resource use of Debian with RHE. The 
>>> comparison should be with Fedora Core.
>>
>>
>> Why not?
> 
> 
> I meant that it isn't fair to RH to say it takes up more disk space when 
> a whole bundle of commercial software is being counted in. RHE is Fedora 
> with a bit of extra QA and lots more stuff.

so commercial software is full of bloat and takes up more room than the 
thousands of pieces of free software in debian?

> 
>> you can compare Debian to any linux distro in any market and it 
>> compares well.
> 
> 
> Except  for ease of installation? :-)

lol, I personally think the installation is one of the quickest and 
easiest out there ;-)

> 
>>
>> It probably runs more servers than RHE and more desktops than Fedora 
>> and it does it all by being free.
> 
> 
> But the stats are about software sales. 

but there is no central seller of debian software so it's impossible to 
judge sales ;-)  It's about use.

> As a manager of my aquaintance 
> likes to say, "perception IS reality". 

while perceived value is so closely linked to monitary value this 
manager is never going to get good value for his money.

> Debian is not going to be used by 
> my employers in the next 2 years. SUSE and Red Hat stand a chance. The 
> alternative is to lose all Unix and move to Windows.

I understand that many employers just don't understand free software but 
what I am saying is those that don't attempt to understand it are going 
to be ripped off with inferior products for ever.  There's no value in 
something for nothing but free software doesn't come for nothing, it 
comes with freedom.

> 
> Why don't you consider Fedora to be free?

I do.  I also consider it to be a dead end.  Eventully the developers 
will get fed up feeding Red Hat and will move to a project that supports 
them a little more.  That can't be Red Hat because they have proved it's 
not possible for them to pay hundreds of developers and while they are 
using all this effort and selling it with a couple of extras the dev's 
will always feel undervalued.

They would get more respect working for GNU, Debian or a BSD who all 
provide software products for zero monitary cost but offer far more 
kudos and feel good respect than Red Hat do to Fedora.  Hundreds if not 
thousands of companies fund development of these projects by directly 
funding developers.  They aren't going to support Fedora development the 
same way because it would be like bleeding in a shark tank, the shark 
being Red Hat.

> 
>> If decision makers can't learn the difference between free and free 
>> then they are obvously not in a position to be making business decisions.
> 
> 
> Ah, but they are in that position and they don't care that they don't 
> know the difference!

They don't know they don't know the difference.  This is where things 
like open advantage come in.  they allow IT guys to point bosses to 
someone to answer questions and they will be able to see how open source 
and free software will help them.

While they don't attempt to understand the difference they are condemned 
to be ripped of by software companies and consultants offering weaker 
solutions with longer dev times, shorter life times and higher general 
requirements.  The extra cost of hiring someone with Linux (or general 
unix) experience far outweighs the costs of proprietory solutions in 
every independent test.  If these people don't want to learn I don't 
care they can carry on feeding Bills bank account and the legions of 
consultants selling whatever is on MS's release schedual ;-)
> 
> Woo
> 
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-- 
<davee> "Sparkes, the Pete Best of LugRadio"