[Wylug-discuss] [WYLUG-DISCUSS] Stuck with Ubuntu?

[Mike Goodman]

On 30 March 2012 00:10, Mike Goodman <mikegoodman1 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Mike Goodman <mikegoodman1 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> On 29 March 2012 19:14, Paul Brook <paul at codesourcery.com> wrote:
>>> >> On 29 March 2012 07:27, Andy Stanford <ajstanford at andystanford.me.uk>
>>> >> wrote:
>>> >> > It stays fairly current, particularly with the more popular apps, but
>>> >> > not
>>> >> > so bleeding edge that you have to massage (or sledgehammer) it back
>>> >> > into
>>> >> > life after an update.
>>> >>
>>> >> That's the second time in this thread I've seen the same appalling
>>> >> American misquote. Edges cannot bleed. A leading edge, the correct
>>> >> expression, can cause bleeding if sharp enough and on an appropriate
>>> >> instrument. The edge itself, however, will not bleed however badly it
>>> >> is mistreated. Would anyone still confused please use the alternative
>>> >> correct term to imply a latest advance, cutting edge. :-)
>>> >
>>> >
>>> Misquoting whom?  If an American is being quoted, then it's likely that
>>> the
>>> > quote is accurate, regardless of whether the phrase has a sound logical
>>> > basis.
>>> > Many of the best quotes come from speakers deliberatly misusing
>>> > conventional
>>> > language structure.
>>> >
>>> > Whether you like it or not, "bleeding edge" is a widely accepted term.
>>> >  IMHO
>>> > It's about as accurate as a "dripping tap".  A tap doesn't drip, the
>>> > water
>>> > leaking through it does.
>>> >
>>> >> > From what you've said about what you're looking for, it might be
>>> >> > worth a
>>> >> > try.
>>> >>
>>> >> Indeed, it seems you have understood the problem. So I could rely on
>>> >> very common apps such as FF. GIMP and whatever the default office
>>> >> suite is not continuing to the point beyond which they are supported?
>>> >
>>> > What exactly are you asking here? I can't make sense of your last
>>> > sentence.
>>> >
>>> Continuing what?
>>> >
>>> > If you're working in isolation from the rest of the world, then a given
>>> > system
>>> > either works or it doesn't.  And it will continue to do so
>>> > indefinitely[1].
>>> >
>>> > As soon as you connect a system to the rest of the world (in particular
>>> > the
>>> > internet), either directly or indirectly, you have to worry about active
>>> > maintenance.  Primarily security (new threats are continually evolving
>>> > and
>>> > exploiting previously undiscovered flaws), but also just to communicate
>>> > with
>>> > other systems that will change over time.  The whole point of a distro
>>> > providing support for a release is that they will perform this security
>>> > maintenance.  Once that support period ends, connecting such a machine
>>> > to the
>>> > internet is irresponsible and often harmful to others.
>>> >
>>> > Paul
>>> >
>>> > [1] Hardware dies eventually, but in practice is usually obsolete and
>>> >
>>> discarded before that happens.
>>>
>>> I was about to reply to Martyn off-list when Paul chipped in. So I've
>>> given it a couple of hours to see if there were any more takers for
>>> that particular bandwagon before replying within the thread. All
>>> triggered from my reply to Andy's very helpful post, the first part of
>>> which was intended as flippant, indeed light hearted. Obviously
>>> misinterpreted by some as far from it. I make no apology for the fact
>>> that flippancy in print often does not match what can be done verbally
>>> by intonation aided by facial expression. Both of you have my email
>>> address, indeed it is repeated on list. If you wish to bring anything
>>> to my attention, including questioning my behaviour or language, you
>>> could have done so privately. I have said and done nothing which I
>>> need to defend. Please see this response to your inaccurate assertions
>>> and the pedantry with which they were delivered as a reply with
>>> equal
>>> but far more accurate pedantry of my own and as an equal and opposite
>>> attack upon your own failings.
>>>
>>> Martyn, modern languages such as English can be described as "live" in
>>> contrast to "dead" languages such as Latin. They can also be seen as
>>> "organic", in that they grow and change over time. The meaning of
>>> individual words within a modern language can and often does also
>>> change over time. Slowly. Anarchy, however, would render a language
>>> meaningless outside a small clique of people using their own specific
>>> jargon, arguing endlessly about the meaning of the word when last
>>> used. Imagine the Norwegian experience of using English because half
>>> can't understand the other's dialect, transposed to village boundaries
>>> as an example. Picture within it the harvest going to rot due to
>>> people understanding an earlier meanings of words used with new
>>> meanings indiscriminately. Society as we know it would not yet
>>> have
>>> been reached. Chimps come to mind.
>>>
>>> The misuse of the expression "bleeding edge" in place of "leading
>>> edge" came into being long before it was ever used by real
>>> technologists or scientists. To be thoroughly pedantic, it would have
>>> been more accurate to say wrongly repeated rather than misquoted. Some
>>> TV presenter misheard leading edge, reported a bleeding edge something
>>> or other and that somehow was picked up, probably as a mickey-take, by
>>> many other semi-literate, semi-articulate or jesting commentators
>>> across the pond. It was a long time ago and I will not be held to
>>> account for not remembering accurately. How it came into use at all
>>> among a community which requires some level of descriptive accuracy in
>>> order to be able to do its job is beyond me. It is rapidly becoming
>>> widespread but is by no means established yet. One lives in hope. To
>>> describe its origins as anything to do with a knife with blood on
>>> is
>>> laughable. A knife with blood on looks like an implement which has
>>> been used to draw blood. A child will tell you that. Why does an adult
>>> have to?
>>>
>>> Paul, the final three paragraphs of your second post are utterly
>>> preposterous. You are an intelligent, articulate individual. Do you
>>> post without reading the thread? I may not have spelt it out, but the
>>> time span under consideration is implicitly and clearly the lifetime
>>> of any LTS distro version. The whole question is of a general nature.
>>> It does not require anything like the precision of detail or language
>>> you demand. Ridiculously in my opinion. A general question is
>>> different in form and nature from a specific technical question.
>>> Whilst your earlier post looked pedantic, this took the biscuit. The
>>> finger-wagging lecture in the penultimate and ultimate paragraphs is
>>> just pointless holier-than-thou time-wasting as well as way off
>>> subject.
>>>
>>> There
>>> is much more I could add but I dare say you have the gist.
>>>
>>> I perceive you both as technically (IT-specific technical, that is)
>>> far superior to me. But I have read much from each of you and can
>>> assure you your energy would be better spent examining your own
>>> command of your mother tongue and your general approach to language
>>> before challenging another's. During the interim, please read a thread
>>> through and absorb the context, rather than looking for faults, before
>>> putting metaphorical pen to paper.
>>>
>>> That's it on English here for me. If anybody would like to raise it
>>> further please contact me directly or start a new thread. My purpose
>>> here is still to decide which distro to install on my shiny new box
>>> with latest whizzy AMD CPU thingy - just sorry I forgot to tie some
>>> mobo research up with it. :-)
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>>
>>> Wylug-discuss mailing list
>>> Wylug-discuss at wylug.org.uk
>>> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/wylug-discuss
>
>
>
> On 29 March 2012 23:51, Roger Greenwood <rogerggbr at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Excellent entertainment guys. None of it taken too seriously by me.
>> The day off the cuff comments between consenting adults gets taken too
>> seriously then I am out.
>> Twitter anyone? (news today).
>> Ps I am sticking with latest ubuntu on one machine in the hope either I
>> start to get it or it becomes more usable. The other machines are staying on
>> ubuntu 10.04/10 in the interests of my sanity for the foreseable.
>> Hope your choice will be interesting enough to share with us.
>>
> News today? Red Hat stocks (USA stock market) hit an all time high
> today whilst one spawn-of-the-devil species, RIM (makers of the
> infernal Blackberry), are on a hiding to nothing. IBM, solid financial
> supporters of the Apache Foundation, by the way, are also doing well.
> Seems M$ are falling behind because they haven't a clue how to charge
> for "cloud" usage. Still doing far too well, mind you. Sorry, though,
> Cannonical are a commercial endeavour and they've let Ubuntu go too
> far for my taste. With not enough feet for the available camps,
> they're neither one thing nor another.
>
> Yes, for the information of others looking for something "wot works"
> I'll be reporting back when I know what I'm doing.
>
> Serious? Paul? Martyn? Me? Minor handbagging and a pint to follow, maybe!

Update. Scientific Linux is at the same stage as CentOS with no
indication it will make the necessary adjustments with the next
release. Noseying around the Debian and offshoot sites such as Mint,
loading the distro would appear to have succeeded and thrown up
another set of problems. I'll give 'em a miss. Some of those issues
are too old and should have been fixed.

The message is clear: If you want to use Linux without too many
hassles, avoid anything with a Gigabyte mobo. I am talking about their
latest stuff. I have not had any earlier experience of the brand.

For my own purposes, it would appear I have a couple of options. The
first is to ask CCL nicely if they'll take the box back with a few
extra quid for something which will work (I had planned on one of
theirs a hundred quid dearer 'til I saw this new, highly praised AMD
CPU). If they won't I'll take a look at consumer law, I've only had it
a few days still. If that fails I'll simply leave the box in its
cardboard box for a few months until CentOS-6.3 is released. It will
be months, too, 6.2 was released within the past very few weeks.

Mike