[Klug-general] KLUG Meeting

Sat Mar 28 00:30:07 UTC 2015

Thanks Kev, apologies as I've only attended 3 meets I meant in the library
@ beany house.

As for the drop in price, I to was surprised as, I believe, was Steve the
broker!  So this PLI is to cover everything I could think a LUG would
perform, in the original terminology.

Feel free to mention if I've missed anything / added something unnecessary;

- Like minded people gather to talk "shop",
- Said people sometimes present information recently learnt, discovered,
made, etc.
- Computers of all varieties can be brought along either for general
consumption or display but overall to share with others and to provide
assistance to those in the dark if your knowledgeable in the area in
question, or can help.
- Install Fest! ( a name I miss )-: )
- Original Definition:  Any and all computers where brought along to a
meeting on a particular day by those interested but unable to complete the
install process for whatever reason.  To users who can help iron out any
kinks that cause roadblocks, gratitude was a to be found in abundance.

- Modern Definition:  It's more of an evolution of a movement ( like
Shedding - googlefu) than a "modern definition" but it looks like
Makerspaces and Shedding are the new thing.  To me it's all one and the
same but with Shedding it seems to be a lot about gardening (here in Kent
anyway, lol), wood working and general handy man duties in and around the
community.  This environment is ideal for those in rehabilitation,
veterans, etc.

Basically I had to explain all that to a broker which wasn't difficult per
se but certainly interesting.  Afterwards Steve broke it down to the bullet
point notes he felt he could get me a deal with. And here's what he said...;

- Presenting Information,
- Teaching,
- Adults,
- Children,
- Using basic facilities,
- Use of power,
- Possible access to the Internet.

Which broke down further to;

- (Possible) Working alongside Children,
- Damages to facilities property,
- Injury included with facility,
- Price of rent, if applicable,
- Cost marketing, again, if applicable,

All this is based on a maximum of £10,000,000 which is what the Orchard in
Dartford required and is the higher of two evils, the other being
£5,000,000 and does not include professional indemnity, which is apparently
not necessary for our needs.

That's roughly £200 per annum.  Divide monthly that's roughly £17.  After
the last meet (and on the mail list) when discussing paying to keep KLUG
running I remember people offered to chip in.  If that number could reach
12, £20 each may not be a stretch.  An other option could be to raise it.
Either through grants - long, laborious and sometimes unfruitful - or by
charging a small fee for an "open(source) day", perhaps our version of the
makerspace ;-).  Any other ideas in this area anybody?

So I suppose I'm asking those in the makerspace know for any further
information, that is if anybody bothered read the entirety of this message
lol.

I agree that KLUG could loose many members should we impose an annual fee.
How would it be determined who is a member, by applying it to the entire
mailing list?  I bet most on the list don't attend for whatever reason.  By
charging at the door?  The number of attendees fluctuates to much to
guarantee collecting enough money in time for one.
>Are we actually wanting to do events where we meet? From experience of
event management over the years I know its easy for people to say they are
interested and are coming but actually the numbers that you end with can be
vastly different. I know things crop up and that is fine.

For an event I would say KLUG could do some social marketing (the only
"free" form of marketing I know other than networking) to attract a wider
audience.  Could KLUG charge a small fee here?  This could raise the
attendance for one.  IMO I feel that if there is a speaker and / or a
presentation that the event would be more popular with a BYOD, casual talk
"after show/party".  That and it's more in line with a LUG.

As I've been writing this for nearly an hour on and off I will also like
add that KLUG could adopt a core group model.  Perhaps made up of; people
who regularly attend; who are willing to chip in; who know they will be
able to attend for the foreseeable future, sporadically or not; have future
interests in the group; either or all or perhaps a mixture. Who knows, I'm
just kicking some ideas around....

Excuse the formatting of this email. It's hard to do bullets without
Markdown in the Android Gmail app, Lol!

Glen
 On 25/03/15 11:23, Glen Skiner wrote:

My turn to apologise for my absence.  Been job hunting! Fun!

No worries. Good luck with the job hunting.

 Anyway, the brokers got back to me today.  The lowest most would go to was
£500 but he managed to fine for that would do it for £230 which is very
good indeed.

Not a bad drop.

 This would cover the Orchard space for KLUG or for a makerspace but only
this space and not the former space in Canterbury.  If we wanted to move it
would cost a bit more to add another space.

There are a few on this list that have maker space experience... Which
Canterbury one is that?

  Hi Glen
Family stuff taking a little time ... Agree, PLI is an obstacle for KLUG
due to the totally informal nature. May need to think about a small annual
subscription for KLUG. A Makerspace ..? May be beyond my skills/time .. but
tell me more ....

Annual subscription.... Well, that caused the initial rift at the formation
of the LUG back in 2001/2. A bit of history into why I've not ventured back
that way. I took over the LUG at this time and was searching for a venue
(nothing ever changes) but I was lucky to find a computer club up in
Maidstone, they were desparate for members as due to the internet their
numbers were dropping as most were using that to find help. They were a
long established club with a formal AGM and member subscriptions with a
nice large hall. I jumped at the chance as it gave our new group a foot
hold, as at the time Linux was in demand and people were looking for help
with installations.

Soon we were out numbering the original members and they being Windows
based were starting to feel a little resentful and so myself and a number
of other members became full members of their club so we could support the
costs. But still the venue prices went up and the club wanted more of a
cost to cover it so we had to ask members to give support. That failed and
lead to us and the club going separate ways. The sudden loss of income I
think caused that club to end.

Now I have nothing against having subscriptions as such, the requirement
there would be that it would have to be a commitment on all sides in
support from more people to make the group actually function as a committee
as after all, this is not Kev's Geeky Chat Time, its a User Group. With
having a firm core we can then deliver on that subscription, do proper
events at proper paid locations, get people in to talk and perhaps group
trips out. These things take time and effort, I have little time myself,
but it can be done, for example last Saturday after three months of
arranging things I managed to pull off a very important symposium with very
busy people from all over the country at a venue I had never been to before
in Bristol. What I am saying is, if there is demand and commitment this
kind of thing can be done and I am willing to do so.

Are we actually wanting to do events where we meet? From experience of
event management over the years I know its easy for people to say they are
interested and are coming but actually the numbers that you end with can be
vastly different. I know things crop up and that is fine.

A bit long winded way of saying yes we can but we will lose many because of
it. But if we are left with those who are committed and passionate about
the group then I don't feel that is a huge loss. We can do a lot with LUG
if we tried.

Looking at the meetup site (which I utterly hate) the next payment is due
in July. I may or may not renew that. This weekend I will get some dates
for social meets at the pub, I first need to find out what times they open
as I don't go to pubs and how no idea what opening times are.

Kev

 Paul

  ------------------------------
 *From:* Glen Skiner <junkfoodjunki at gmail.com>
*To:* Paul Lawrence <paul.z.lawrence at btinternet.com>
*Sent:* Monday, 16 March 2015, 10:33
*Subject:* Re: KLUG Meeting

 Okay so,
- It's an "Empty" shop unit with tables and 50 chairs.
- Has tea and coffee making facilities,
- Needs Public Liability,
- Contact:  debbiecarey at orchardsdartford.co.uk
So for KLUG may not be great due to needing public liability insurance.  As
for a makerspace, well I may look into getting public liability insurance
for the club (not an individual).
Glen
 On 16 Mar 2015 09:49, "Glen Skiner" <junkfoodjunki at gmail.com> wrote:

Thanks great. I have sent an email over the weekend.  If I don't get a
response I was going to follow up today, but let me know what they say.
Glen
On 16 Mar 2015 08:50, "Paul Lawrence" <paul.z.lawrence at btinternet.com>
wrote:

 Hi Glen,
I'll contact the Orchard today asking what they mean by community group and
come back to you. If it's positive, I'd be up to help.

 VBR

Paul

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