[Gllug] SwitchedOnUK

[Jason Clifford]

On Fri, 17 Nov 2006, James Roberts wrote:

> Cost pcm of old POTS ISDN system (with 100% uptime)
> 
> 	say £1450
> 
> Cost current system
> 
> 	say £1100
> 	(but unreliable - client has lost significant multiple K work)
> 
> Cost with leased line
> 
> 	say £1900
> 
> Show me the saving if it is moved to leased line :)

The "saving" on a leased line is not immediately financial but rather in 
terms of reliability and performance.

It you are paying £1100 per month for an SDSL service giving such poor 
performance please contact me asap. I just quoted someone £1000 per month 
for a 10Mb leased line in London.

> > Name and shame then. Who is the backbone provider and who the major VoIP
> > supplier. If they're rubbish then we should be told !
> 
> Backbone: Mistral

Mistral's BT Central capacity is a small number of 155Mb pipes. They 
wholesale supply AceInternet who have been selling high bandwidth ADSL 
services at low prices for a long time. I do not believe Mistral have the 
BT Central capacity to continue providing a high quality SDSL service.

> VoIP - can't. Commercial confidence is commercial confidence. However, 
> you can guess around things that are devilish with numbers after them.
> 
> The problem is nothing to do with the backbone provider BTW. Our NOC
>   is showing good figures to the routers at each end of the link.
> 
> The problem is with BT. The exchanges at each end are crap. The one in N 
> London is un-staffed: they have to parachute engineers in from 
> Hertfordshire and half of them don't seem to know what they are doing. 
> They go to fix one line and un-patch the other - more than once now. 
> When it *is* patched its performance varies at random. Getting 
> performance reports from BT is not easy. The SLA for SDSL that is on 
> offer gives a 72 hr window before they have to escalate priority on repairs.
> 
> The inner London exchange is bad as well; though does have staff 
> engineers on site.

That's BT for you however we're not seeing any problems on any London 
exchange at the moment and we've got lots of users in London.

> SLAs can be upgraded: Leased Lines can be installed. But the LOGIC of 
> VoIP is to save money. For this client it has not done so, it has cost 
> them money and clients (try 3 days of no phone service and 3 months of 
> unreliable service), and making it as reliable as the old pots will cost 
> more per month than putting the pots back. See the problem?

That's a failure in their implementation rather than VoIP itself as has 
already been stated.

> Look: current technology is designed to guarantee the delivery of a 
> packet in a timeframe. IP is not designed to do this. QOS on IP does not 
> replace the guaranteed packet delivery. VoIP on IP v6 with inbuilt QOS 
> does not guarantee (AIUI) delivery in the same timeframe as current 
> technology does.

The main telco's have been using IP to route calls for a long time on 
their core networks. Most international calls are now IP routed.

Jason
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